Is EHU metering a good investment?

GEandGJE replied on 28/11/2022 17:23

Posted on 28/11/2022 17:23

I was going to post this in the thread that has been Deleted User as a number of folk were saying that EHU Metering would make pitch prices cheaper, so Let's play the You Said, We Listened and Implemented game. This is my view based on my experience as an IT Infrastructure Project Manager and in IT Procurement.  To satisfy the We don't want EHU and want cheaper pitch prices group of people, the We only want to pay for the electricity we use group of people and the I'll pay whatever as I'm on holiday group of people, the clubs only option is to move to metered usage. How does the club do that and what investment would be needed. Lets estimate that the club has over 10,000 pitches with an average of 2 hookups per bollard that's 5,000 bollards that will need to be modified and/or replaced and some of those will need groundwork undertaken for new cabling etc, it will require  putting all pitches out of action and subsequent loss of income whilst the work takes place. This can't all be done at once and I think that a 5 year rollout period would be a stretch and it would take a dedicated team at HQ to manage. They would need to procure equipment, electrical installation teams, groundwork teams, IT systems and software to operate the metering and payments, negotiate contracts with all the power companies who supply the club sites and negotiate with any land owners. I don't think you would get much change from a £5 million investment of the clubs (our) money. Issues that the club would need to consider 1) leased sites where the land owner doesn't give permission for the work to be carried out or the lease will soon come to an end 2) the price per kW from each of the power suppliers will vary depending on contract length and renewal dates, so do they average that price out across all sites or do you have different EHU costs in different areas of the network 3) do you factor the suppliers standing charge into the  metered cost,  4) the club would need to move to a credit card only payment system where the payment for EUH used is automatically deducted at the end of your stay 5) a central dispute resolution team, as there will always be people who will challenge the bill and that shouldn't be the on site teams and finally the biggest question for the club, 6) what return on investment will the club get. I doubt very much that the savings made from the electricity used would come close to the investment needed therefore the remaining investment would need to come from reserves and most likely recouped from increased pitch prices. Lastly this would give the club a very inconsistent offering with not all sites offering metered EUH, the cost of EHU could vary from site to site and an even bigger price variance across the network. Not a very good Business Case in my view, in terms of both investment and inconvenience to the membership so I can't see it happening I'm afraid.

Cornersteady replied on 29/11/2022 10:31

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:26 by SteveL

To be fair to CY he was talking about :- “That would immediately encourage a more 'responsible use' of electricity” rather than specifically savings. 

It would certainly make folk think. 10 amps would be fine for us now, with how we operate in our MH. However, when we had our Cadiz with microwave, up to 3kw Alde and all the other electrical gadgets we used to carry, even with 16 amps on some occasions planning was required.

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:31

Fair enough but it would be saving something even if not money?

Just interested as probably our next caravan will have it is 3Kw needed with that type of heating?

JVB66 replied on 29/11/2022 10:32

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:19 by Takethedogalong

Some of us have been Members long enough to recall when EHU bollards were installed into Club Sites. They weren’t done all at the same time, but over an extended period of years. Certainly Marazion (a leased site) was done this way, because I can recall having the option of “with or without” for at least a couple of seasons on there. The paddock area at the back of reception remained bollard free for a while. Reverse situation to outfits now, caravans with plug in capabilities were just getting popular, so if you had a newish outfit, you went for a bollard. Now, we have outfits capable of doing without EHU, or using minimal, so the trend has gone full circle. Hence why the Club is thinking about changes.

I’d also like to say that I would resent not being trusted enough to be honest about hooking up if given the option. I pointed out somewhere else how easy it would be to have a simple system for monitoring. We spent 15 years with this option on a Cornish Site, friends with the owners, and as far as I can recall, they didn’t think it much of an issue. But perhaps folks twenty odd years on have different morals🤷‍♀️

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:32

I have also been with this club a few years and your last paragraph says it all with many these days it seems doing what they. can to not having to pay for anything they can get away with

 

replied on 29/11/2022 10:37

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:32 by JVB66

I have also been with this club a few years and your last paragraph says it all with many these days it seems doing what they. can to not having to pay for anything they can get away with

 

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:37

The user and all related content has been Deleted User

Takethedogalong replied on 29/11/2022 10:44

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:32 by JVB66

I have also been with this club a few years and your last paragraph says it all with many these days it seems doing what they. can to not having to pay for anything they can get away with

 

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:44

I don’t share your heavy cynicism JV. The vast majority are good folks, minding their own business, happily staying legal and crime free.

What has changed is that there are now few systems in place, less staff and resources in place to actually catch the few who do push the boundaries. You can have as many rules, regulations, laws etc…. In place, but if there’s no one doing any monitoring, checking, patrolling, then it all falls apart. Organisations of all kinds are relying heavily upon technology too much, and even cutting costs in terms of utilising this as it should be. 

SteveL replied on 29/11/2022 10:46

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:31 by Cornersteady

Fair enough but it would be saving something even if not money?

Just interested as probably our next caravan will have it is 3Kw needed with that type of heating?

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:46

We kept ours in storage and in cold weather it was very useful to initially heat up the van. We then reduced it to 2 / 1 KW depending on how cold it was. 2 was needed to keep the bathroom warm in cold weather. Now with the MH, the cab heating takes the chill off on the journey and the 1.8 KW blown air is fine. Not felt the need to boost it with gas yet.

young thomas replied on 29/11/2022 10:50

Posted on 29/11/2022 09:57 by JVB66

That it seems is similar to what the staff of the company that the engineer who came to rectify the fault on OHs stairlift yesterday apologised for the lack of information he had been given 

The  Dutch company owners have been trying to make a replacement system to be user friendly for two years after someone  new at senior director level decides we need a more up to date system even after when put to the staff no real explanation was forthcoming

It seems it is endemic with companies today

 

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:50

Systems become redundant for many reasons....hardware advances which make more and more processes available but the software can't cope...witness the relentless march of added processes to phones (the vast majority of which millions will never understand let alone use) and then the software on old units can't be updated.

the reverse is also true...with a new operating system release that allows a 'new experience'😉 but your old phone (computer, tablet etc) can't meet the minimum hardware requirements...enforced obsolescence of our kit...nice little earner.

then there's the skill and technical ability to support the new 'experience' and this is where non IT megacompanies struggle as IT staff gets older and auditors see a support cliff edge ahead...so what do they do?

they go for a popular package (plenty of support available from the manufacturer, no need for in house IT staff, or another known system that (they think) can be tailored to do the new brief..and this is where the club is with its attempt at making a system designed for European bookings the same for the UK.

the new system has processes that don't transfer exactly into the uk booking market. The imported google search function isn't designed to allow customers a small but relevant view of just the UK sites...

the IT team are surely spending day and night trying to build IT bridges into and out of the new system to make it look like it's doing what we the customers want.

in fact, behind the scenes, the system still works as it was implemented but there is an array of buffers between us and it.....each one needs time, processing power and space to do what this particular fix needs to do...converting data, bypassing requirements, including others...

and what do we get...a slower system as much of the time is spent converting something that's wrong (from the customers perspective) to something that's right (for system use)...

all this stuff should have been done once at implementation time, not leave the 'wrong' in place and then have to convert stuff every single time a user gets on the system.

I'm sure it will be deemed fit for purpose at some point when all the fixes and bridges have been built, tested, added and implemented...but it was never meant to be this way for sure.

if it was....someone needs sorting...total shambles.

 

Cornersteady replied on 29/11/2022 10:51

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:46 by SteveL

We kept ours in storage and in cold weather it was very useful to initially heat up the van. We then reduced it to 2 / 1 KW depending on how cold it was. 2 was needed to keep the bathroom warm in cold weather. Now with the MH, the cab heating takes the chill off on the journey and the 1.8 KW blown air is fine. Not felt the need to boost it with gas yet.

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:51

Thanks Steve.

Cornersteady replied on 29/11/2022 10:55

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:50 by young thomas

Systems become redundant for many reasons....hardware advances which make more and more processes available but the software can't cope...witness the relentless march of added processes to phones (the vast majority of which millions will never understand let alone use) and then the software on old units can't be updated.

the reverse is also true...with a new operating system release that allows a 'new experience'😉 but your old phone (computer, tablet etc) can't meet the minimum hardware requirements...enforced obsolescence of our kit...nice little earner.

then there's the skill and technical ability to support the new 'experience' and this is where non IT megacompanies struggle as IT staff gets older and auditors see a support cliff edge ahead...so what do they do?

they go for a popular package (plenty of support available from the manufacturer, no need for in house IT staff, or another known system that (they think) can be tailored to do the new brief..and this is where the club is with its attempt at making a system designed for European bookings the same for the UK.

the new system has processes that don't transfer exactly into the uk booking market. The imported google search function isn't designed to allow customers a small but relevant view of just the UK sites...

the IT team are surely spending day and night trying to build IT bridges into and out of the new system to make it look like it's doing what we the customers want.

in fact, behind the scenes, the system still works as it was implemented but there is an array of buffers between us and it.....each one needs time, processing power and space to do what this particular fix needs to do...converting data, bypassing requirements, including others...

and what do we get...a slower system as much of the time is spent converting something that's wrong (from the customers perspective) to something that's right (for system use)...

all this stuff should have been done once at implementation time, not leave the 'wrong' in place and then have to convert stuff every single time a user gets on the system.

I'm sure it will be deemed fit for purpose at some point when all the fixes and bridges have been built, tested, added and implemented...but it was never meant to be this way for sure.

if it was....someone needs sorting...total shambles.

 

Posted on 29/11/2022 10:55

+1

Bet you weren't expecting thatsmile 

But yes we've both posted it's a yes and no situation, works for some not others, and I do wonder what's happening with people in the background who either bought, implemented... whatever?

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