Is EHU metering a good investment?

GEandGJE replied on 28/11/2022 17:23

Posted on 28/11/2022 17:23

I was going to post this in the thread that has been Deleted User as a number of folk were saying that EHU Metering would make pitch prices cheaper, so Let's play the You Said, We Listened and Implemented game. This is my view based on my experience as an IT Infrastructure Project Manager and in IT Procurement.  To satisfy the We don't want EHU and want cheaper pitch prices group of people, the We only want to pay for the electricity we use group of people and the I'll pay whatever as I'm on holiday group of people, the clubs only option is to move to metered usage. How does the club do that and what investment would be needed. Lets estimate that the club has over 10,000 pitches with an average of 2 hookups per bollard that's 5,000 bollards that will need to be modified and/or replaced and some of those will need groundwork undertaken for new cabling etc, it will require  putting all pitches out of action and subsequent loss of income whilst the work takes place. This can't all be done at once and I think that a 5 year rollout period would be a stretch and it would take a dedicated team at HQ to manage. They would need to procure equipment, electrical installation teams, groundwork teams, IT systems and software to operate the metering and payments, negotiate contracts with all the power companies who supply the club sites and negotiate with any land owners. I don't think you would get much change from a £5 million investment of the clubs (our) money. Issues that the club would need to consider 1) leased sites where the land owner doesn't give permission for the work to be carried out or the lease will soon come to an end 2) the price per kW from each of the power suppliers will vary depending on contract length and renewal dates, so do they average that price out across all sites or do you have different EHU costs in different areas of the network 3) do you factor the suppliers standing charge into the  metered cost,  4) the club would need to move to a credit card only payment system where the payment for EUH used is automatically deducted at the end of your stay 5) a central dispute resolution team, as there will always be people who will challenge the bill and that shouldn't be the on site teams and finally the biggest question for the club, 6) what return on investment will the club get. I doubt very much that the savings made from the electricity used would come close to the investment needed therefore the remaining investment would need to come from reserves and most likely recouped from increased pitch prices. Lastly this would give the club a very inconsistent offering with not all sites offering metered EUH, the cost of EHU could vary from site to site and an even bigger price variance across the network. Not a very good Business Case in my view, in terms of both investment and inconvenience to the membership so I can't see it happening I'm afraid.

mickysf replied on 04/12/2022 15:02

Posted on 04/12/2022 14:53 by

As a modest user of power I dont see why I should have metering  inflicted on me  because you want to charge your car. If car charging is going to be so important  I would think it much the most  fair option would be for changing stations for those who need them.

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:02

I think the operative word there is ‘moderate’ user David. We are not the issue here! It’s the deliberately wasteful inconsiderate users that are inflicting this possibility on us all.

replied on 04/12/2022 15:10

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:02 by mickysf

I think the operative word there is ‘moderate’ user David. We are not the issue here! It’s the deliberately wasteful inconsiderate users that are inflicting this possibility on us all.

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:10

The user and all related content has been Deleted User

JVB66 replied on 04/12/2022 15:14

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:14

There will always be those who will take advantage of any facility that is available without a thought of the consequences of their actions and as said "eat as much as possible"even if  not wanted 

How often has one seen those at help yourself restaurants pile their plates up high and then leave much to waste  buffets are the same

mickysf replied on 04/12/2022 15:16

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:10 by

Not as I see it. I could be controversial  here and sugest cold winter days are best spent at home so closing sites during  winter months would save much more.

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:16

Why close them as long as we pay for our own consumption and the sites are viable? If they aren’t and are subsidised by other members I’d agree.

JVB66 replied on 04/12/2022 15:24

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:10 by

Not as I see it. I could be controversial  here and sugest cold winter days are best spent at home so closing sites during  winter months would save much more.

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:24

The idea is not that controversial ,as I understand it ,all year sites could well be the first to have metered EHU points to make them more viable,  lease available, followed by Jan closing sites then seasonal Oct/Nov 

replied on 04/12/2022 15:25

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:16 by mickysf

Why close them as long as we pay for our own consumption and the sites are viable? If they aren’t and are subsidised by other members I’d agree.

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:25

The user and all related content has been Deleted User

mickysf replied on 04/12/2022 15:55

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:25 by

I got the impression  you are more concerned about green issues. Is it ok to use as much as we want so long as we have deep pockets. Personally it is not an issue to me, as my caravan goes into hibernation  October to late May .

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:55

Yes David. As long as you pay your own way and are not deliberately wasteful at the expense of others your pocket length shouldn’t matter. I don’t put mine in hibernation, it’s a four season van and we love it. As for Green Issues the World has changed regarding those, on the whole for the better we would hope. Certainly attitudes have! Maybe the future too if we act accordingly & sensibly.  Moderately will do for me too presently. 

KjellNN replied on 04/12/2022 16:54

Posted on 04/12/2022 09:25 by ChocolateTrees

YT,

I am not sure 40kWh has been mentioned as a sensible usage? That would be a HUGE amount of electricity drawn by a single caravan or camper. Close to a constant 1.7kW for the entire 24h period. Even 24kWh would be pushing it for a “normal” user, but might be used in winter. 
If you add an awning heater, running 24h then you might approach that, but that is discouraged by the club and many CL. Car charging could take you close to that number, but even that would be tough without risk of tripping a breaker. 

However, 40kWh in a 24h period is possible, even on a 10a hookup. And at 60p/kWh that is £24 not £15. Completely unsustainable on a commercial pitch, as you say. 

Posted on 04/12/2022 16:54

I was the one who related how in one very  cold 24 hour period, using all our own facilities, with Alde heating and HW, we used 40kWh.     We were also astonished that we had used so much.

However, our van is older and not so well insulated as current ones, we find 2kw on the Alde is sometimes insufficient if very cold, and use gas instead. We like to be warm, but not hot, usually have the Alde at 21 in the evening, 17/18 during the day, and 13/14 overnight,  If the heating is on, then HW is also being heated.

Our van also does not have LED lighting, or a solar panel.

If/when electricity is metered, depending on the unit price, we would use more gas if it worked out less expensive, and might well use the site facilities too.

Fortunately, we very rarely go away in the van in winter!

replied on 04/12/2022 17:38

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:55 by mickysf

Yes David. As long as you pay your own way and are not deliberately wasteful at the expense of others your pocket length shouldn’t matter. I don’t put mine in hibernation, it’s a four season van and we love it. As for Green Issues the World has changed regarding those, on the whole for the better we would hope. Certainly attitudes have! Maybe the future too if we act accordingly & sensibly.  Moderately will do for me too presently. 

Posted on 04/12/2022 17:38

The user and all related content has been Deleted User

JVB66 replied on 04/12/2022 17:49

Posted on 04/12/2022 15:25 by

I got the impression  you are more concerned about green issues. Is it ok to use as much as we want so long as we have deep pockets. Personally it is not an issue to me, as my caravan goes into hibernation  October to late May .

Posted on 04/12/2022 17:49

  1. Many can have Deep Pockets it those with Short Arms and squeeze every last ounce of what they can get which is where the problem issurprised 
  2. When we see all those on jollies in private aircraft going to conferences on the pretext of caring for their citizens and this suffering planet is where the real problems  areyell
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