Is EHU metering a good investment?

GEandGJE replied on 28/11/2022 17:23

Posted on 28/11/2022 17:23

I was going to post this in the thread that has been Deleted User as a number of folk were saying that EHU Metering would make pitch prices cheaper, so Let's play the You Said, We Listened and Implemented game. This is my view based on my experience as an IT Infrastructure Project Manager and in IT Procurement.  To satisfy the We don't want EHU and want cheaper pitch prices group of people, the We only want to pay for the electricity we use group of people and the I'll pay whatever as I'm on holiday group of people, the clubs only option is to move to metered usage. How does the club do that and what investment would be needed. Lets estimate that the club has over 10,000 pitches with an average of 2 hookups per bollard that's 5,000 bollards that will need to be modified and/or replaced and some of those will need groundwork undertaken for new cabling etc, it will require  putting all pitches out of action and subsequent loss of income whilst the work takes place. This can't all be done at once and I think that a 5 year rollout period would be a stretch and it would take a dedicated team at HQ to manage. They would need to procure equipment, electrical installation teams, groundwork teams, IT systems and software to operate the metering and payments, negotiate contracts with all the power companies who supply the club sites and negotiate with any land owners. I don't think you would get much change from a £5 million investment of the clubs (our) money. Issues that the club would need to consider 1) leased sites where the land owner doesn't give permission for the work to be carried out or the lease will soon come to an end 2) the price per kW from each of the power suppliers will vary depending on contract length and renewal dates, so do they average that price out across all sites or do you have different EHU costs in different areas of the network 3) do you factor the suppliers standing charge into the  metered cost,  4) the club would need to move to a credit card only payment system where the payment for EUH used is automatically deducted at the end of your stay 5) a central dispute resolution team, as there will always be people who will challenge the bill and that shouldn't be the on site teams and finally the biggest question for the club, 6) what return on investment will the club get. I doubt very much that the savings made from the electricity used would come close to the investment needed therefore the remaining investment would need to come from reserves and most likely recouped from increased pitch prices. Lastly this would give the club a very inconsistent offering with not all sites offering metered EUH, the cost of EHU could vary from site to site and an even bigger price variance across the network. Not a very good Business Case in my view, in terms of both investment and inconvenience to the membership so I can't see it happening I'm afraid.

KjellNN replied on 01/12/2022 12:22

Posted on 01/12/2022 11:31 by Takethedogalong

I think life in general is coming as a bit of a shock for some who have never needed to keep an eye on various bits of the household budget, let alone what happens when away. It’s a steep learning curve for some, whilst others have been doing what they can for much longer.

The horrible irony is that many folks live their lives like this, normally superb at budgeting, but sadly have no slack for current rises, and it’s hitting them hardest. ☹️ 

Posted on 01/12/2022 12:22

OH was just saying something along the same lines as your first paragraph a  few months back when the media went mad with money saving tips such as....

Do not heat rooms you are not using

Turn off lights when you leave a room

Keep doors closed

Only wash full loads in the DW and WM

Using a tumble dryer costs more than drying outside

Only boil as much water as you need

Do not leave taps running while washing up

Turn down your CH thermostat

etc etc

This is all basic stuff, and as far as we are concerned, just what we normally do anyway.

 

 

Takethedogalong replied on 01/12/2022 12:33

Posted on 01/12/2022 12:22 by KjellNN

OH was just saying something along the same lines as your first paragraph a  few months back when the media went mad with money saving tips such as....

Do not heat rooms you are not using

Turn off lights when you leave a room

Keep doors closed

Only wash full loads in the DW and WM

Using a tumble dryer costs more than drying outside

Only boil as much water as you need

Do not leave taps running while washing up

Turn down your CH thermostat

etc etc

This is all basic stuff, and as far as we are concerned, just what we normally do anyway.

 

 

Posted on 01/12/2022 12:33

Same here K. Newspapers are full of sensationalist reports of “my heating bill quadrupled overnight” . Then you realise those involved had never checked their monthly DD’s, so didn’t have a clue. As I say, for some it’s just normality, for others, normal has been one of profligacy and dare I say ignorance at times, if they could afford to pay.
Our (much younger) lovely new neighbours shot round to us last Winter when we had a long power cut, to see if we were ok. Bless them, they found us toasting away in front of stove, kettle on top, iPads fully charged via battery packs, happy as Larry! I did make them a cuppa😁

KjellNN replied on 01/12/2022 12:50

Posted on 01/12/2022 12:50

Having been used to what we consider a normal way of operating, our daughter was amazed at the way her in-laws did things at home.

They apparently did not use, despite actually having them, timers or thermostats on their heating, instead they just turned it full on when they woke up and shivered  till it warmed up, then when it got too hot they opened a door or a window.   I think they may have stopped doing that now!

Turning off lights and  closing doors  was also not normal, so she is forever turning off lights and closing doors her husband has left open.   Now that Callum is big enough to reach the light switches, he gets sent to do it.  He is getting good at closing doors too, even little Nathan (22 months) can close doors!

 

JVB66 replied on 01/12/2022 13:10

Posted on 01/12/2022 12:50 by KjellNN

Having been used to what we consider a normal way of operating, our daughter was amazed at the way her in-laws did things at home.

They apparently did not use, despite actually having them, timers or thermostats on their heating, instead they just turned it full on when they woke up and shivered  till it warmed up, then when it got too hot they opened a door or a window.   I think they may have stopped doing that now!

Turning off lights and  closing doors  was also not normal, so she is forever turning off lights and closing doors her husband has left open.   Now that Callum is big enough to reach the light switches, he gets sent to do it.  He is getting good at closing doors too, even little Nathan (22 months) can close doors!

 

Posted on 01/12/2022 13:10

It is sobering when speaking to those of us who grew up with rationing and make do and mend as to how far it seems younger generations view cost savings that is completely alien it seems when trying to say how it is quite easy if thought about " but how much does it really save by just closing a door or switching. lights off" is the reply so often heard by those who change their phones because I have been told I can?

obbernockle replied on 01/12/2022 14:40

Posted on 01/12/2022 10:06 by

I suspect that it's to do with how they calculate the pitch price.  Should they reduce the price by both the infrastructure installation and maintenance cost and the price of the unused electricity or just the latter or some other amount. For an organisation that is incredibly secretive it's not something they are keen to do for fear of the members finding out just how much they are being over charged.  

Posted on 01/12/2022 14:40

"every penny of which is ploughed back into our not for profit club for the benefit of the members"  sealedsealedsealedsealedsealedsealed

Tammygirl replied on 01/12/2022 20:09

Posted on 01/12/2022 20:09

We have just returned today from 10 weeks overseas.  We have 7France, Spain and Portugal.

No sites in France were metered almost all of them were 6amp.

Spain 7 sites all 6amps, 2 of which were metered. The allowance was 4 KwH after that you pay. I paid a couple of euros on the site we stayed at for 9 nights but the site we stayed on for 7 nights no charge. Given that it was mid to 20s in temp we didn't have heating or hot water on. I did use a hairdryer and hair tongs, the fridge was on electric and I cooked using a Remoska. 

Portugal, no meters, 6amps.

We also stayed on a number of Aires with ehu, we were given the option. Some would come and connect you to the box while others it was on trust (they did walk the site a couple of times a day) they were not big sites.

Site prices varied from 14 euro (Portugal) to 22 euro (Spain) and Aires from 10 euro to 18 euro. The dearest of these was in Spain. The metered sites were 18 euro and 20 euro.

At home we use bulk LPG for heating, hot water and cooking. We have 10 solar panels and in a good summer we use around 6 to 8 KwH a day, winter it's more like 10 to 12 KwH.

I don't mind using meters where there is sufficient sun to use the solar panel on the van but in winter in the UK it might be a tad expensive. However I would prefer that than an inflated price across the board as we are not high users. I'm happy to pay for what I use. 

young thomas replied on 02/12/2022 08:47

Posted on 02/12/2022 08:47

"I don't mind using meters where there is sufficient sun to use the solar panel on the van but in winter in the UK it might be a tad expensive. However I would prefer that than an inflated price across the board as we are not high users. I'm happy to pay for what I use. "

TG, sums it up nicely.

with power prices rising fast and, inevitably, dragging the inclusive prices with it, summertime (peak) pitches are going to be mightily expensive💷 if, for those with solar or are very low users, there isn't an option to either remain disconnected or to be metered.

looks like more THS sites during the UK summer👍

cyberyacht replied on 02/12/2022 09:41

Posted on 01/12/2022 09:24 by Cornersteady

Apart from labelling someone's valid opinion as an attempted deflection why not answer a simple question?

£5 has been quoted as the reduction in the nightly fee. Personally I think that's a bit low but if that was the case would you then use club sites? 

What's the average club site nightly fee at now?

Posted on 02/12/2022 09:41

Knocking a fiver off would still mean that a site would be, more often than not, north of £25. For a non EHU pitch, even with a toilet block, I would consider £25 the most I would be prepared to pay unless there was something quite exceptional about the location. The majority of CAMC sites are a bit in the back of beyond.

near Malvern Hills Club Campsite Member photo by Andrew Cole

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