Increase size of CLs?

It looks a lovely site DD, I agree. Lots of space. That's why I asked my question regarding going down the LA route. I think for anyone wanting to set up a site as a thriving business, then given what a lot of tourers now like/demand, then going down the alternative route may be best, even if there are more hoops to jump through initially. There appear to be pro's and con's to each method. I doubt that a single 5 van CL site could be a sustainable stand alone business, but as diverification might work well to bring in more income. 

What is meant by a 'stand alone business'? I can't imagine any CL being seen as a sole source of income as,even if it was full every day of the year it would only produce a net income of £15-20K.  It is usually a second income stream to an existing business.

As for HS on CLs, it does enable a longer 'season' and is more attractive to MHs. It doesn't have to be every pitch or indeed a 'solid' one. Reinforced grass with either plastic or embedded screen walling can provide a strong yet aesthetic surface. What could kill CLs is an increasing demand for shower/loo blocks which can rarely be justified on a cost/income basis. Those facilities are already provided by the majority of CC sites.

CLs provide a 'cheap and simple' option. Don't destroy that option by excessive infrastructure demands.

That's what I meant CY, hard for a CL to be sole source of income, not enough profit in it. Hence if anyone is considering opening a site, applying for more pitches via LA route would be option. Opening a CL, with five pitches is a fine balancing act between expenditure and income, wanting to put more pitches on might reap quicker profits, but isn't the ethos of CLs/CS's. 

Agree totally with your view of CLs. A lot we stay on have a mix of grass and HS/stabilised pitches. We tour throughout Winter months with little problem. 

What is meant by a 'stand alone business'? I can't imagine any CL being seen as a sole source of income as,even if it was full every day of the year it would only produce a net income of £15-20K.  It is usually a second income stream to an existing business.

As for HS on CLs, it does enable a longer 'season' and is more attractive to MHs. It doesn't have to be every pitch or indeed a 'solid' one. Reinforced grass with either plastic or embedded screen walling can provide a strong yet aesthetic surface. What could kill CLs is an increasing demand for shower/loo blocks which can rarely be justified on a cost/income basis. Those facilities are already provided by the majority of CC sites.

CLs provide a 'cheap and simple' option. Don't destroy that option by excessive infrastructure demands.

Write your comments here...

an excellent post sir. We have many folk asking if we have a shower block. Er no its a CS. I think some people don't get the concept of cl Cs.

as for income, unless you are in a tourist hotspot there is no money in cl Cs I can assure you, it is in effect a hobby for many of us. I wish it could sustain us as I would happily fully retire tomorrow and spend my days mowing and strimming and stuff. That would be wonderful

It looks a lovely site DD, I agree. Lots of space. That's why I asked my question regarding going down the LA route. I think for anyone wanting to set up a site as a thriving business, then given what a lot of tourers now like/demand, then going down the alternative route may be best, even if there are more hoops to jump through initially. There appear to be pro's and con's to each method. I doubt that a single 5 van CL site could be a sustainable stand alone business, but as diverification might work well to bring in more income. 

Judging by what many members have said to us and wonderful reviews posted we do have a spacious and lovely CL takethedogalong, and we're not planning on going commercial. Although I understand the rules say 5 vans, I believe a simple way to help CL's become more profitable would be to gauge there capacity by square meterage. Let's say we allot a 12 meter square plot - pitch per outfit. If your site based on these dimensions can still offer a site where the members don't feel hemmed in, claustrophobic, then why not allow it. Yes it may mean we have to lobby the government, which possibly won't happen, but if the CL network is to flourish in the future then something like this may need to happen. These are purely ideas based on frustration at having to turn people away. We are going to investigate opening a second CL and see where that takes us.EV

The trouble is EV, it would not be a CL if it had more than 5 vans. It is knowing that there can only be a maximum of 5 vans on site that so many value in the current CL network.

That is not going to change,

I have argued many times in the past that with 5 vans maximum, the key is to keep costs down to an absolute minimum and even so, a CL is never going to be very much more than a hobby business.

Hi EV, I said two days ago that I thought you would soon outgrow the confines of CL regulations. I didn't realise it would happen quite so soon !  You say you are frustrated at having to turn people away, and your would be visitors must be equally frustrated too.

You ask about relating number of pitches to size of area, and I can only suggest something like the French regulations for Aires Naturelles  - for a long time the limit was 25 outfits provided that one hectare (2.5 acres) was available - and they have just increased that limit to 30. That's why there are pitches for everyone over there but a desperate shortage of pitches over here. CL owners don't make much money. Caravan owners have to book way ahead. 

Maybe then my idea of "Super CL's" that allow more units (given space) and would make spending on infrastructure more worthwhile might one day be a possibillity? It would also allow those content with the traditional CL to continue to enjoy them.

The trouble is the exemption  legislation, I cannot see it ever being increased to any more than 5 vans even for a "Super CL"

The point I was making was that governments CAN change the rules. The French government did just that. Our government could too - just as they recently changed planning regulations for home extensions. 

Yup, got that.

I just wonder in this country with all the detractors of caravanning and caravanners, a lack of space for housing and planning departments under pressure generally the governent might just do away with the exemption certificate scheme altogether if pushed for a change in legislation.

That would be problematic for the CC as so many claim on here they are only now in the CC for access to the CL network