CAMC - Use of language

Rob2CathDavies replied on 24/10/2024 01:20

Posted on 24/10/2024 01:20

Just a quick moan to get a few things off my chest about the CAMC and current deterioration in use of the King’s English, in my humble opinion.

I predict that many reading this will think ‘Get a life!’

Firstly, the Club has started to use the word ‘guests’ on various site notices, and in the site rules.  After 35 years membership, I thought that I was part of the Club, perhaps even in some way, a part owner of the Club and its sites?  I would prefer the term ‘Site User’ which covers members, non-members, and day visitors.  I don’t think of myself as a ‘guest’, do you?  

Secondly, the small notice boards that the CAMC sells for motorvanners to mark their pitch now say ‘Sorry, this pitch is taken’.  Why ‘sorry’?  Why would I be sorry to be using a pitch?  Why not just ‘This pitch is being used by a motorvan’.  One shouldn’t need to apologise for being there!

Lastly (and this one has been mentioned in another thread).  The CAMC claims that awnings are ‘free’, dogs are ‘free’, under 5’s are ‘free’.  No, they are ‘included in the price’!

I am going to copy and paste this into an email to the Sites Department, in the faint hope of a response…!

Cornersteady replied on 25/10/2024 17:23

Posted on 25/10/2024 14:53 by Graydjames

Guest means either "a person invited to someone's home or to attend a social function" or "a person staying at a hotel or guest house". It is obviously inappropriate to use such a term for a person or people occupying their own caravan or motor home on a club pitch. Visitors, members, campers, site-users are all preferable. "Site-user" is a bit cumbersome, but I do not think anyone in their right mind would ever say "house-user" which Corners thinks justifies ruling out "site-user". I am not sure it does.

As DK says "I am pitched here" would be abrupt, but the fault there does not lie in the omission of the word "Sorry". "This pitch is reserved" or simply "Reserved" as you would see on a restaurant table, for example, would be fine. No doubt, soon, restaurant tables will say "Sorry, I am reserved". Let us hope not. Sorry is just not needed. "Sorry, I don't know" in response to a person's question is polite and I would always say that too. However, that is a quite different circumstance. 

On a separate point, the use of the first-person pronoun is hugely irritating to me.  It's like, "Sorry, I am not in service" which you see on the front of buses often. "This bus is not in service" would be much better. Buses are not living things. 

I do not think the use of "free" in publicity is about the use of English per se. Nonetheless, it is annoying, albeit used by marketeers universally despite it being blatantly misleading. 

"Going forward" and "reaching out", mentioned by Tinny, are hugely irritating, especially the latter which, as is so often the case, is an American import; I see this a lot in emails from across the pond and I HATE IT. I would love to make some sarcastic response to it, but I have never dared.

I am a pedant about use of English; I know there are those who talk about language evolving; but too often the evolution is driven by ignorance.   

Posted on 25/10/2024 17:23

but I do not think anyone in their right mind would ever say "house-user" which Corners thinks justifies ruling out "site-user". I am not sure it does.

I didn't anything about justifying ruling out site user. If you read my post again you'll see I said guest has a higher standing than user and then I asked a question:

'I think it's actually an improvement and a more polite way of the way the club thinks about us, to me a quest has a higher standing than site user. Guests are usually treated better usually? Would you be happy with hotel user? Do I have guests to dinner or my house users?'

Where in that do you get I'm ruling out site user?   

 

About saying sorry. Are the circumstances different? In both cases someone, either the club or the pitch occupier is  apologizing (laughing) for something that is not their fault. Either the club or the occupier, or like the example I gave, myself.

 

As to 'imports', I'm not really bothered, if a word or phrase gets over, sorry communicates, what someone is trying to say then it's fine by me. Language does and has evolved by whatever means necessary, as I was told by my Head of English.

 

Anyway, moving on and reaching out, and not trying to be a monday morning quarterback, or try to pass the buck, or even ride shotgun over this, after all we're just shooting the breeze here and it's best not to get behind the eight ball. But we've had lots of complaints about the club on CT (justified or not), prices, pitch rules, arrivals... I'm not sure how many and would hesitate even to give a ball park figure so I'll plead the fifth on that otherwise that could be for the birds?

And now we have the language used on site signs! If this is all there is left well the club must be doing something right and (to end with another import) you've got to give props to the club for that.

 

  

Takethedogalong replied on 25/10/2024 20:48

Posted on 25/10/2024 20:48

I’m another person who loathes all the corporate jargon and business speak terms. Had to suffer it far too often at work. It used to make meetings very tedious, boring. 

My OH made a lovely ‘Camper Van parked here’ sign when we had our first little Camper. First time we used it, over forty years ago, we left it on our pitch space at Beddgelert, along with a dog screw. Came back after a day out, and some thieving so and so had taken both😡 We just use an old number plate on two tent pegs now. 

richardandros replied on 26/10/2024 08:03

Posted on 26/10/2024 08:03

Rob2 - I wouldn't worry about the CAMC's use of English when the BBC - who used to be the defenders of all matters regarding spoken English - are by far the biggest offenders.

I don't know if anyone else noticed but on yesterday's news, a reporter was doing a piece to camera about concrete cladding and the fact that some panels have a polystyrene backing and are therefore now considered unsafe.

He went on to talk about another type - which he described as "more concretey"!!! (Not even sure how to spell itundecided).

Don't get me started on "different to" instead of the correct, "different from". 

 

 

Cornersteady replied on 26/10/2024 09:16

Posted on 26/10/2024 08:03 by richardandros

Rob2 - I wouldn't worry about the CAMC's use of English when the BBC - who used to be the defenders of all matters regarding spoken English - are by far the biggest offenders.

I don't know if anyone else noticed but on yesterday's news, a reporter was doing a piece to camera about concrete cladding and the fact that some panels have a polystyrene backing and are therefore now considered unsafe.

He went on to talk about another type - which he described as "more concretey"!!! (Not even sure how to spell itundecided).

Don't get me started on "different to" instead of the correct, "different from". 

 

 

Posted on 26/10/2024 09:16

I was taught that too, but is different to now incorrect?

From some simple searching and listening to English teachers recently both are now considered correct, with different to in spoken (British) English far more common and will eventually replace from, the language evolves I suppose. I would suspect you will worry when the American different than starts to appear?

'That caravan is different from that caravan' is fine, although to could be used but in 'This site will be different to the next one we visit' using from here just does not work or sound right?

I don't think it matters, am I bothered? (thanks to Lauren for bringing that back in fashion), sorry am I concerned? Or as I've been hearing the past week and a half in a school from the children - I'm not fussed? about all that. The answer is no personally. 

But I will admit to having a dislike for poor punctuation that makes things unclear (let's eat Grandma v let's eat, Grandma), and especially the apostrophe, as in when they are used when they shouldn't - tea's, coffee's.

But at the end of that day it's the site itself that attracts not the language used on it.

joanie replied on 27/10/2024 16:29

Posted on 27/10/2024 16:29

 we are members as we pay a membership fee.  Sorry is just being polite, people used to use please and thank you but you don't hear it much now so I expect sorry will go the same way. 

If you pay for your stay and don't have any dogs or young children, then the cost has not been included , so when I pay , I don't pay for my dogs therefore they are free. 

Over the years words change their meanings, I can't keep up with it all, in 2024 , 200 new words have been added to the dictionary. I still don't like being called guy, as in , come on you guys or hi guys. We are becoming very Americanised, if that's a word. 

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